Also, thanks for your take on downtown Glendale. It certainly is raw and needs to be refined, but I don't think the city government is focusing on that at all. Like Phoenix, they're determined to keep pouring resources into making their big suburban development successful.

Until Phoenix pays as much attention to creating residential units as it does parking space, it will never be truly urban. It will continue to loose ground to cities like Tempe, Scottsdale and Mesa (and even Glendale, whose downtown has perhaps the best raw urban fabric in the Valley).

As far as urban fabric goes, I don't see anything wrong with large hotels, a convention center and a university campus in downtown. Many cities have these. They just need to be surrounded by fine-grained fabric to balance them out.

Thanks for mentioning Mesa. I'm usually not out in Mesa very much, but I haven't quite reached the phase in life in which places like Arizona Museum for Youth matter more than SideBar and FEZ. That phase is approaching rapidly, so my appreciation for Mesa and the light rail extension through it may grow.

It's good to see Mesa making very smart moves in bringing light rail down Main Street. I'm glad to see them handling it well, and I hope they reap the rewards.

With regards to Glendale (which is where I currently live), I am continually frustrated by the city government's lack of investment in downtown in favor of the artificial “destination” of Westgate. Their desires to run light rail down I-10 to Westgate seems like they just want a shuttle from Mesa, Tempe and Phoenix to Westgate, not to any other parts of the city. Glendale has opportunities to become the centerpiece of the West Valley, but that's a discussion for another post.

I do hope that Scottsdale sees the value of light rail as a way to bring even more vitality to Old Town and the surrounding area. I particularly hope they follow Mesa's lead and run the train down Scottsdale Road, instead of routing it around the edge of downtown. That may be a hard sell to the city council, but success in Mesa and a changing from the old guard to the young may change some opinions.

Finally, you make a great point about the neighborhoods of Phoenix. I hadn't thought of the various historic neighborhoods and the value they could bring to the city identity if Phoenix chose to emphasize them. I agree that the efforts to brand downtown seem ridiculously artificial (Copper Square? Really?) and that the city should work on highlighting the identities which are already growing organically.

Personally I think Phoenix has missed the boat and is going down the wrong path. Developments like the Sheraton, CityScape, ASU and the Convention Center illustrate that the city doesn't get urban fabric. At best they are mere patches to cover up what has been (and continues to be) destroyed. At worst they are a decisive move towards suburbanizing the downtown core: http://yuriartibise.com/2010/02/24/cityscape-su…

We do have a tremendous opportunity to grow our own modern urban fabric here, because we're not as tied to the past as older cities. I hope that things like ASU and CityScape can provide economic engines to help downtown Phoenix, but counting on large developers and institutions to create a vibrant downtown is a strategy for failure. As you pointed out in your blog post on Urban Fabric (http://yuriartibise.com/2010/07/19/urban-fabric/), a fine-grained downtown is far more desirable. A space like that is created when small business and entrepreneurs are involved in the development. Causing that to happen should be the goal of the Phoenix city government.

For the typical resident of the Phoenix Metro Area, I'd say your triangle is on target. Five years ago it was for me; however, in recent years I've realigned many of my activities to focus on the linear corridor created by light rail. That means for me the trio is Central Phoenix, Tempe, and Mesa.

Now, to borrow your words, before all you Mesa haters react, let me finish my comments. Right now, light rail extends only a mile into Mesa. The only real attraction near Mesa's one station is Mekong Plaza, which is a great place to eat and shop, but its design is not friendly to pedestrians. Mesa clearly missed the memo on TOD and walkability during the construction of the light rail starter line.

It looks like Mesa is going to get it right, however, in round 2. The only light rail extension moving forward right now is the Central Mesa extension, and the Mesa City Council has made a number of smart decisions. First, Mesa should be commended for bringing light rail to its downtown rather than a more suburban destination. Glendale also has a walkable downtown with interesting attractions, but its city government seems hell bent on bringing light rail to Westgate instead of downtown. Second, Mesa made the decision to run light rail right down Main instead of obscuring it on a side street. Third, it made the decision to narrow Main to one lane in each direction between Country Club and Mesa Dr. The latter decision may prove controversial, but it will do a lot to maintain walkabilty in Mesa's downtown core.

About that core — Mesa's Downtown hardly has the nightlife pulse of Tempe or Scottsdale, but it works well as a daytime family destination. For someone like me who is at a phase of life in which dinosaur museums matter more than dance clubs, I find it to be one of the most underrated downtowns in the Phoenix Metro Area. Access and exposure via light rail may start to change that.

As for my erstwhile friend Scottsdale, I'll be candid in saying that part of me wants to see Scottsdale lose its allure as a consequence of sitting out light rail — not to the point that Scottsdale fades away, but to the point that its misguided leaders are forced to reconsider their resistance to transit. Maybe that will happen, but maybe it won't. After all, Georgetown is still a vibrant part of Washington DC despite not being near that city's subway system. I cope by redirecting some of the time and money I formerly spent in Scottsdale toward Central Phoenix, Tempe, and Mesa, but I'll make exceptions for unique and worthwhile Scottsdale businesses like Sweet Republic, Echo Coffee, etc.

It looks like I'm getting close to violating my rule that blog comments should never be longer than blog posts, so I'll close with a thought about your statement that “Phoenix has…um, something. Phoenix hasn’t quite established what it will be.?” My reaction is that Phoenix should not overthink this question. Phoenix is the big city at the core of the metro area. Scottsdale and Tempe are smaller communities that need more distinctive identifies, but Phoenix doesn't necessarily need that type of specialized branding, and efforts to create it by the Downtown Phoenix Partnership seem artificial. Instead, Phoenix should concentrate on strengthening neighborhood identifies, which are often indistinct in Phoenix. Any great city is a collection of great neighborhoods.